The VG Resource

(09-11-2011, 12:49 PM)Rökkan Wrote: [ -> ]Here's how modern Sonic games work and why most people don't realize how bad they can be:

Do anything that is slightly against what the regular player might do or what seems to be the most straightforward way of getting through anything. Basically, play the game with some curiosity.

Then you'll see how much the game fucks you over.

Part of it is because all the levels are designed as a big cluster of platforms on an abyss, so getting slightly offtrack will make you fall off, but it's mostly because the designers don't look at how their game allows the player to take several courses of action and designs level sections with only one course of action in mind, making it so that if you take any other action or even DO the intended action however in a SLIGHT DIFFERENT WAY you will get screwed over. I.E.: There's a part on Frog Forest in which you take a spring to land on a platform that's upwards and forward to where you are, and if you do that with any formation that's not Fly, your character will boost forward a bit and fall off the platform and die every fucking time.

Some might argue against this "big cluster of platforms on a big abyss" saying that "well it's 3D so levels are like that in 3D" (which doesn't really cover it, after all, invisible walls are A Thing but whatever), but goddamn Dimps thought it was a REAL FUN IDEA to implement this same design in every game after the first Sonic Advance.

Guys, if you are making a level in a 2D game with "layers" of ground, how will I know that I can safely fall from here and that there's going to be a path below that saves me? This feels like pulling the carpet off your feet. And yes, sometimes it can be obvious when there mustn't be a ground below to save you, but a lot of times, you fall off to your death by simply backtracking a bit or thinking that you are finding out a secret room or a shortcut and SPECIALLY for trying to do ANYTHING on something that's supposed to be purely automatic and cinematic (and most of the times you can't know whether something is automatic or not, since sometimes you also die for just holding forward instead of jumping off where you are or something like that)


However I have some doubts whether everyone that doesn't see how glitched and lazily designed doesn't really face those mistakes. I think you guys actually die because of things like that but, for some strange and sad reason, you think that it was actually your fault and not the game's. Like "oh DUH why did I have any curiosity or thought there would be an extra life or something here, I am so dumb I shouldn't explore at all of COURSE" or "CLEARLY I wasn't supposed to press the button at this moment here it was OBVIOUS and INTUITIVE I just DIDN'T SEE IT let me re-do this a couple more times until I figure out how to get it right"

Honestly, I'd play with friends and we'd have a blast. Stuff probably happened occasionally, but I didn't notice anything at all, if I died, I waited to respawn and jumped back into playing, because the fact is, I died, no amount of speculation or if it was my fault or not was going to change it. So I enjoyed the game.

I don't get the hate for Heroes, really. Sure it's no Adventure 3 but it was something different for the Sonic series. I appreciated the return to "classic" style levels, and the return of the Chaotix was epic coming off of Sonic Mega Collection's comic book archive.

Shadow The Hedgehog was definitely not as good as it could have been. The whole multiple endings thing was okay, but it can be confusing despite there being a true ending(Which was also shite), but the gameplay was alright. I actually had fun trying to shoot down that GUN airplane, but regular enemies had way too much HP, which devalues the Homing Attack severely.

I don't think I have to get into Sonic 06, do I? I'm pretty sure most people couldn't even get past the first mach speed section. No, not because it's hard, but because it's a glitchy mess... oh wait that's the entire game. This was the only Sonic game I chose not to keep, and for good reason. I wouldn't even want this game to show up in my Games History on Xbox Live.

Also a bit late, but when Donkey Kong Country 3 first came out I didn't get into it. I never got past the first mill level. I'm not sure why, but I think it had to do with all the new overworld mechanics or something. The fact I was more into DKC1 and 2 didn't help either. I recently decided to complete it on the GBA, and it ended up becoming my second favorite of the original Trilogy. Returns is still better than 3 though IMO, and 2 is the king.

Oh I played Sonic Heroes with friends too, it was a blast. We would watch him re-do this entire section over and over again trying to land a homing attack on this enemy and dying for like 5 minutes and it was really really funny. When he finally did it he died short after. We laughed extremely hard. It was a fun time.

The funny thing about Very Hard Mode is that the levels themselves aren't hard, but the game is so broken that any slight thing you do or you don't do fucks you over really hard!

I think it boils down to some people being more picky than others. A minor glitch to someone might be game breaking for someone else. I'm not going to deny that Sonic games have glitches, even Adventure 1 had them. But did they hinder my play experience? Not really, but it might be different for someone else.

I will say that I can't stand it when a homing attack glitches and misses an enemy entirely, sending me into the abyss. It's a prominent glitch in Shadow.

(09-11-2011, 09:29 AM)Mighty Jetters Wrote: [ -> ]You guys must've been doing things I never do or something if you're triggering that many glitches.

You know, it's odd;

I've spoken to various people on the subject of Sonic Heroes, and how it's essentially broken.
Some of these people told me that they'd experienced very few glitches, and some others, experienced non at all.

When I played, I was assaulted by glitches at every turn, even when I tried not to deviate from the path you're forced to follow.
The homing attack would sometimes fail, which usually resulted in me being thrown off the level. Sometimes, if I switched characters while I was sliding along one of those rails, I would fall and die. At times, characters would clip through objects, and one other thing I remember well was Knuckle's attack sometimes clipping through enemies without damaging them, while I still suffered contact damage.

It was unbearable.

(09-11-2011, 02:06 PM)Basement Bill Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-11-2011, 09:29 AM)Mighty Jetters Wrote: [ -> ]You guys must've been doing things I never do or something if you're triggering that many glitches.

You know, it's odd;

I've spoken to various people on the subject of Sonic Heroes, and how it's essentially broken.
Some of these people told me that they'd experienced very few glitches, and some others, experienced non at all.

When I played, I was assaulted by glitches at every turn, even when I tried not to deviate from the path you're forced to follow.
The homing attack would sometimes fail, which usually resulted in me being thrown off the level. Sometimes, if I switched characters while I was sliding along one of those rails, I would fall and die. At times, characters would clip through objects, and one other thing I remember well was Knuckle's attack sometimes clipping through enemies without damaging them, while I still suffered contact damage.

It was unbearable. I remember getting as far as the egg carrier (or, whatever Eggman had in that game) with Sonic and co. before giving up. I played a few levels with the other characters, which were insultingly identical to Sonic's levels, then didn't look at the game for some time.

Perhaps the people who don't notice any glitches are from an alternate reality that intersects with ours, one where the game was programmed by humans instead of chimps.

what version did you even get.

I know for a fact the PS2 one was glitchy as hell but I don't think the GCN one was.

I had the Cube one, it was glitchy.

(09-11-2011, 02:06 PM)Basement Bill Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-11-2011, 09:29 AM)Mighty Jetters Wrote: [ -> ]You guys must've been doing things I never do or something if you're triggering that many glitches.

You know, it's odd;

I've spoken to various people on the subject of Sonic Heroes, and how it's essentially broken.
Some of these people told me that they'd experienced very few glitches, and some others, experienced non at all.

When I played, I was assaulted by glitches at every turn, even when I tried not to deviate from the path you're forced to follow.
The homing attack would sometimes fail, which usually resulted in me being thrown off the level. Sometimes, if I switched characters while I was sliding along one of those rails, I would fall and die. At times, characters would clip through objects, and one other thing I remember well was Knuckle's attack sometimes clipping through enemies without damaging them, while I still suffered contact damage.

It was unbearable.

YES. EXACTLY.

The homing attack launch off the level thing and knuckles' punches clipping through enemies killed me SO MANY TIMES.

(09-11-2011, 02:22 PM)masterofthething Wrote: [ -> ]what version did you even get.

I know for a fact the PS2 one was glitchy as hell but I don't think the GCN one was.

I had the Gamecube version, and I was honestly shocked when I first heard that the GC version was supposed to be the least glitchy.

Though, I did play PS2 Shadow the Hedgehog once, which wasn't quite as glitchy/unplayable as Heroes, but god damn, they sure did try.

Well that, I have to say that I have experienced a few times where the Power-type character's punching/charging attack threw me off the level a few times, and when I was grinding rails I'd fall off if I tried to jump side to side so I always had to use the Fly-type character, but otherwise, I seriously haven't found a whole lot of bugs.

Last I played I was trying to get all A ranks, which was very much possible with the game how it is. IDK, I don't usually mind minor glitches, and I guess I enjoyed it so much I didn't pay that much attention either.

Quote:where the Power-type character's punching/charging attack threw me off the level a few times, and when I was grinding rails I'd fall off if I tried to jump side to side so I always had to use the Fly-type character

You must be a big Sonic fan to ignore them so easily. To me, that's pretty game breaking...

Honestly, I have the PS2 version of Sonic Heros.

I don't really encounter glitches.

The closest thing I come to one is my niece trying to find a way to throw herself off the edge of the level and die just to laugh at it, while that isn't exactly hard in that game, it isn't hard to avoid either.

(09-11-2011, 12:49 PM)Rökkan Wrote: [ -> ]However I have some doubts whether everyone that doesn't see how glitched and lazily designed doesn't really face those mistakes. I think you guys actually die because of things like that but, for some strange and sad reason, you think that it was actually your fault and not the game's. Like "oh DUH why did I have any curiosity or thought there would be an extra life or something here, I am so dumb I shouldn't explore at all of COURSE" or "CLEARLY I wasn't supposed to press the button at this moment here it was OBVIOUS and INTUITIVE I just DIDN'T SEE IT let me re-do this a couple more times until I figure out how to get it right"

Actually, this seems entirely true for me. I was about to guess at this point that I probably was just really oblivious to the glitches :F



I only distinctly remember getting stuck at the second Robot Carnival boss fight thing with Team Shadow. I was in that fight for literally an hour because something never spawned towards the end of it. I can't remember if it was because a spring pad didn't launch me up high enough to kill a flying enemy or if the goddamn rocket never spawned, but I remember being stuck there for sixty minutes, thinking "Oh, maybe I'm not doing this right."

I don't remember how I exactly beat it though, I might have just restarted the battle entirely.

I guess I'm a really odd case, because I don't remember hardly any of that happening to me.

I'm just kinda carefree and tend to not worry about smaller things, and focus more on the actual game.

I guess you guys are more sensitive to glitches than we are?