What is it about Sonic that makes everybody retarded? VS is giving completely logical and warranted reasons to be frustrated with the game and everybody's acting like it's some sort of huge issue.

He said the gameplay looks fine and the problem lies in the fact that the levels are literally rehashes. Because they are. Did you see those Casino Zone leaks? Did you notice that the level structure is literally exactly the same as it was in the original? No noticable changes were made. The same gimmicks are in the stage, in the same places, in the same format. There is no evolution. Nothing is different. It's all. The same.

And THAT is where the problem lies. Sonic 4 does not look like a sequel. It looks like the first two Sonic games in an HD format.

This is not a problem, as I'm sure all of us would eat up an HD remake of the first three Sonic games.

The problem lies in the fact that Sega is labeling Sonic 4 as a sequel when it clearly isn't.

Episode 2 better have some progression, because Episode 1 looks like nothing but a rehash in its current state.

(04-07-2010, 06:35 AM)Alpha Six Wrote: What is it about Sonic that makes everybody retarded? VS is giving completely logical and warranted reasons to be frustrated with the game and everybody's acting like it's some sort of huge issue.

He said the gameplay looks fine and the problem lies in the fact that the levels are literally rehashes. Because they are. Did you see those Casino Zone leaks? Did you notice that the level structure is literally exactly the same as it was in the original? No noticable changes were made. The same gimmicks are in the stage, in the same places, in the same format. There is no evolution. Nothing is different. It's all. The same.

And THAT is where the problem lies. Sonic 4 does not look like a sequel. It looks like the first two Sonic games in an HD format.

This is not a problem, as I'm sure all of us would eat up an HD remake of the first three Sonic games.

The problem lies in the fact that Sega is labeling Sonic 4 as a sequel when it clearly isn't.

Episode 2 better have some progression, because Episode 1 looks like nothing but a rehash in its current state.

Minus all the posts of continuity, this is exactly what I'm trying to say.

While I do agree that Episode 1 looks like a huge Sonic 1 + 2 remake, I honestly think everyone is getting ahead of themselves and the majority of fans forgetting that Episode 2 has a chance of being a little more fresh to the fans.

Maybe Episode 2 will be a Sonic CD remake. Personally, I do want. 8)

Tyvon pretty much just said it all. What really bugged me to no end is that they labeled the game as the hedgehog's big-ass comeback, made a whole bunch of hype for it and stated that the game was going to be the best thing since Sonic 3 came out, and the game feels like it's just a remake. It feels like they tried harder to advertise the game than to actually make it. As I said before though, I'll be hoping that Episode 1 was just them being too afraid of doing something new and doing it wrong and the new stuff comes in Episode 2. But I'm not too confident about that.


arguing time

(04-06-2010, 10:49 AM)Vipershark Wrote: I'm not even going to complain about the gameplay as it could still be totally fun (and obviously I haven't played it myself), but you have to admit that judging from those videos alone the homing attack breaks the game and makes it infinitely easy. And the levels still follow the Sonic Rush "single path" layout style rather than the multiple path style of the original games.

I disagree there, it seems like they tried to follow the level design of the classics a tad. It definately doesn't seem like the same level design as the classics, as there are still some really linear paths here and there that emphasizes speed with lots of speed boosters and loopings than platforming, which is a huge game design flaw of newest Sonic games, they emphasize too much that Sonic IS indeed really fast instead of, you know, adding skill to the gameplay. I.E.: The meter that lets you boost in Sonic Rush, specially on Rush Adventure, fills by skill. Destroying enemies in rows and doing as many air-tricks as you can while finishing it with a "finisher" air-trick before landing the ground. If you're not skilled, you'll always run out of boost. If you are skilled though, you'll be bursting through the entire level with the boost. In Sonic Unleashed though, the level design automatically gives you rings - which fills the meter. With the level design constantly throwing rings at your way, you'll never run out of boost and you'll keep being extremely fast, no matter how good or bad you are, just to see HOW FAST SONIC CAN GO instead of playing it skillfully.

(04-06-2010, 12:10 PM)Djanjo Wrote: I will however bust your chops on this little idea that you and others have in your head that SEGA needs to cater to your claims/whims/wants at all. They don't. Like I keep saying the Sonic fandom is not like a woman who's staying with an abusive husband. Your all spoiled children who are promised something and just because it wasn't as great as you were initially hoping for you bitch and get nasty. The parents try as best they can and tell you Disney World cause they're trying something new, but you actually ended up at Disney Land...Europe. WHICH ISN'T BAD! But not necessarily good either.

(04-06-2010, 03:54 AM)Rökkan Wrote: I find it funny that the internet is making fun of the fandom for being too close-minded and just going to buy the game if it's perfect in every way, when a year ago the fandom was being made fun of because they'd buy any kind of shit that SEGA throws.

I need to emphasize this more, here's an example:

In earlier "new" Sonic games, like the Adventure series, Heroes, etc, most Sonic fans actually enjoyed a lot all the new Sonic games and didn't understand why the critics were the ones who actually destroyed them using, as arguments, wonky camera and "it's not Classic Sonic". The fandom was often ridicularized, being called as being stupid consumers that'd buy any stupid Sonic idea that SEGA'd throw at them. And now they're being ridicularized for being the exact opposite.

You wanna know why? Because you can't generalize a giant fandom like this, fucking cocks. Will I have to repeat every argument of this thread all over again? Since Day 1 I was afraid that they'd rehash everything and woops, look what at what we got! Maybe people will start listening now! But, as I was saying, you can't generalize the fandom, because as I said, the fandom is really divided. The same part of the fandom that has 3001 sonic fan-characters recolors with ten dicks and three pairs of boobs isn't the same one that doesn't like Sonic 4 saying that Sonic doesn't have black eyes and therefore it sucks. The fandom is really divided, Archie, New Sonic, Old Sonic, blah blah blah fuck you guys I'm not repeating this shit.

(04-06-2010, 01:38 PM)Djanjo Wrote: Sigh, yes they did say if you've been waiting for this game then be glad it's come back. The formula is the same as last though. Green Zone, Water Zone, Casino Zone, Marble like Zone, Sonic has a new move, Sonic hunts down Eggman rinse and repeat. Every side-scroller installment was like that (Tweaks hear and there).

Sonic CD didn't have a Casino Zone or a Marble Zone, Sonic 1 didn't have a Casino Zone, Knuckles Chaotix didn't have a Casino Zone, a Water Zone or a Marble Zone. Wanna know why? Because even though they'd do similar thematics, the classics always tried to introduce new thematics and do an entirely different landscape and situation out of old themes. Casino Night and Carnival Night for instance, are two similar themes, but but quite different if you inspect them closely. Heck, you don't need to be a genius to know that a Las Vegas-like gambling city is different than a rollercoaster-like theme park night city with baloons and party. However, this is what SEGA doesn't get, and that's why we have so many rehashed levels out of the casino thematic.

(04-06-2010, 11:52 PM)Vipershark Wrote: Basically, what I'm trying to say is that this is all about continuity.

While yes, they're all the same series, I consider the different "spinoffs" (used very loosely to describe the different series such as rush, advance, adventure, etc) to be different universes, per se.

What this means is that all the games within a universe should follow the story of that universe.

It's obvious that Sonic 3 directly follows Sonic 2, and there is significant story to back this up. The same goes for S&K to sonic 3, even though it's technically one game. While I don't know how sonic 1 leads into sonic 2, there is an official story somewhere.

But from what I gather, Sonic 4 completely destroys the continuity built up the the past four games in the "Genesis Universe". There appears to be absolutely no reason for any of the events that are happening to happen.

See what I'm saying? This is where my problem lies. I'd be completely fine with this game if it was called ANYTHING other than Sonic 4. Yeah, the whole rehashing thing would still be sort of a dick move on sega's part, but at least the game wouldn't completely destory the series.

Eh, this is the part that I don't agree with you. Sonic 2, despite the name, doesn't offer any sort of real direct continuity to Sonic 1, as of many fans think that Sonic CD is a sequel to Sonic 1 and a prequel to Sonic 2. Sonic CD also has no linkage to other games, neither does Knuckles Chaotix, etc. The only classic games that has any direct continuation are Sonic 2 to 3. (& Knuckles doesn't count because it is Sonic 3). Direct continuity is not a huge problem (if it is a problem at all) with Sonic 4. It DOES lack storytelling though. What is the island that Sonic got? How did he get there? What is the E.G.G. Station Zone? How did Sonic end up there? How is the station? How did Sonic get out of an station so far from Earth that you could see the whole planet out of the window?

Quote:Sonic 1 didn't have a Casino Zone

Spring Yard Zone. It technically wasn't a casino, but it counts. It has the same basic theming of neon and bight colors and "bouncy" obstacles.

(04-07-2010, 07:25 PM)Rökkan Wrote: Sonic CD also has no linkage to other games, neither does Knuckles Chaotix, etc.

This is essentially the reason why I don't consider Sonic CD (and now that you mention it, Chaotix [even though it's actually a spinoff starring knuckles]) to be canon.

Yes, they are canon somehow, but I don't seen them withing the same "universe" as Sonics 1-3K.

Quote:It DOES lack storytelling though. What is the island that Sonic got? How did he get there? What is the E.G.G. Station Zone? How did Sonic end up there? How is the station? How did Sonic get out of an station so far from Earth that you could see the whole planet out of the window?

I noticed this as well.
The game offers up no explanations whatsoever of how and why sonic does what he does.

neither did sonic 1 & 2

Sonic 2 did. Not to the extent of 3K, but especially in the last couple of levels it told what was going on.

Robotnik flees the factory in metropolis zone in the wing fortress. Sonic and Tails board the Tornado and chase after him. (Sky Chase) They catch up, but Robotnik shoots the Tornado out of the sky. As it falls, sonic jumps onto the wing fortress, and chases a fleeing tobotnik to his rocket that he launches to get up to the death egg. Sonic grabs on, and rides inside. In the Death Egg, sonic fights robotnik's metal sonic clone, then defeats him in a final battle. Sonic then jumps out of the death egg and falls back to earth, where sonic 3 starts.

can we rename this thread Sonic 4 - One Trillion Words About Nothing tia

(04-07-2010, 11:22 PM)bryan GT broyan Wrote: can we rename this thread Sonic 4 - One Trillion Words About Nothing tia

Isn't discussion like this the whole point of threads in the first place though? Besides, this is nothing compared to the kind of crap threads you find on a lot of other sites.

you know, i remember the first time i reached wing fortress i died because i didn't realise i had to jump out of the plane C:

(04-07-2010, 11:42 PM)Shadowth117 Wrote:

(04-07-2010, 11:22 PM)bryan GT broyan Wrote: can we rename this thread Sonic 4 - One Trillion Words About Nothing tia

Isn't discussion like this the whole point of threads in the first place though? Besides, this is nothing compared to the kind of crap threads you find on a lot of other sites.

don't bother replying
it's bryan

Bump.

Quote:A desire to be better. Sega has received a terrific response from the community regarding sonic 4...

Did anyone else here just, well...burst out laughing?

that would be, 5 months ago.

What do you mean?