If this is not the kind of thing I should talk about on this site, then please forgive me. It's just that this topic has been sitting on my chest for ages now and I would like to know what you guys think.

Throughout my life on the web, I met a lot of people and users who shaped my life. Some of them were delighted by my company and find it a pleasure to be around me. Other people, on the other hand, just want to be hateful to me regardless of their reasons and leave a negative impact on my life in their favor. I wouldn't be surprised if any of you guys ran into similar situations.

For a lot of the people I met, each one has a varying level of talent in certain areas (I'll use artistic talent for my example). A lot of people online I met are hardly good at drawing, but the vast bulk of them are hardly ever nasty in terms of attitude. As for other people I met, they might be able to draw at the level of a god, but the they treat others (including me) is anything but godlike (unless a spiteful god is taken into consideration).

For someone like me, as much as I like good artistic talent, I would rather be around someone who only draw stick figures and has a nice attitude towards me. Sure, I would like it if this person would have a little more artistic talent, but not everyone I met shares these two golden values I look out for. Before anyone brings it up, I know that there are plenty of talented people who claim that they are friendly and all that, but even they can have their own flaws, which leads to them looking for reasons to not like me.

I'm not sure if anyone would agree to this opinion, but I think that what it means to be a nice guy is to act kind and fair to everyone, even to some of the people you don't exactly like. Sure, it's okay to get upset and angry every now and then, but as long as it doesn't go as far as to one side resorting to acting hateful in retaliation, everything should be good.

Important for what? Friends?

I'd rather befriend someone based on how we connect over how kind/talented they are. I've made great friends who don't fit your definition of "nice guy" but are fun to be around.

But if someone is a jerk to you of course you don't want to be their friend.

Befriending someone is easy, if you follow those steps:

1: Are you happy being with him/her?
2: Is he/she happy being with you?
3: Do you forgive his/her messups, and vice-versa?

Chances are you are already friends.

Talent and 'being nice' aren't mutually exclusives at all. You can find very talented people who are really nice friends, just like you can find nasty people with no artistical talent whatsoever. What matters the most when making friends is if you two actually care about yourselves, and nothing else. Sure, it's a plus if he/she is a talented artist, in which case you could be doing collabs/practicing art together/discussing about art, but it's not a 'must-have' thing.

Now, a friend is not having a god/dess besides you; you will find a lot of flaws as time passes, and so will they. If you think that they are worth keeping, that they are great friends and they understand you, and vice-versa, accept them for what they are and go on. Friendship is a mutual thing, you can't give in 100% and the other give just 30%: both should be investing wholly in their friendship, if it's smething true.

As for common friendships, as in people you know but isn't intimate enough, prime for harmony and well-being. Treat everyone as how you'd like to be treated, and everything will be fine. You may find even more friends this way.

It sounds kinda cliché and all but it takes time, it's not all that simple tbh, but I believe it's like this.

(07-24-2013, 01:57 PM)Sengir Wrote: Important for what? Friends?

I'd rather befriend someone based on how we connect over how kind/talented they are. I've made great friends who don't fit your definition of "nice guy" but are fun to be around.

But if someone is a jerk to you of course you don't want to be their friend.

True, but what if that person wants to change and is actually a nice person deep inside? People can start out on the wrong foot and still like each other in the end. It just depends on how willing each side is going to compromise to form a good friendship. Over time, though, it's okay to expose some of your habits and vices. I just don't want annoy of those to be an excuse to end a perfectly good friendship.

(07-24-2013, 02:32 PM)Gorsalami Wrote: Talent and 'being nice' aren't mutually exclusives at all. You can find very talented people who are really nice friends, just like you can find nasty people with no artistical talent whatsoever. What matters the most when making friends is if you two actually care about yourselves, and nothing else. Sure, it's a plus if he/she is a talented artist, in which case you could be doing collabs/practicing art together/discussing about art, but it's not a 'must-have' thing.

I never said that I wanted a friend to have talent. I actually wanted a friend who is nice enough to like me and give me plenty of chances in case things go sour. I met some people who flat out end a friendship over petty reasons, so this is what I often look for in a person.

Friendship for me is based on mutual respect.

Sometimes I have little in common with my friends, sometimes I have a lot. But what makes us friends is that we see each other as someone who's worth listening to, standing by, and trusting.

Kindness can be a reason to respect someone. A few people I know respect me for my "caring nature" as they would say.

(07-24-2013, 02:32 PM)Gorsalami Wrote: I never said that I wanted a friend to have talent. I actually wanted a friend who is nice enough to like me and give me plenty of chances in case things go sour. I met some people who flat out end a friendship over petty reasons, so this is what I often look for in a person.

And that's why they aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, you shouldn't befriend people solely for their talents.

My friends are all talented and shit, but it's not why I befriended them in first place. It's because they make me feel important as a human being, the mutual caring and the feeling of helping each other, that's what I appreciate in a friendship.

Hey, forgive me for bumping this topic up, but since I was the one who create the topic in the first place and I'm going to contribute something meaningful to it, I don't see how that is breaking any rules.

(07-25-2013, 01:41 AM)Koopaul Wrote: But what makes us friends is that we see each other as someone who's worth listening to, standing by, and trusting.

Kindness can be a reason to respect someone. A few people I know respect me for my "caring nature" as they would say.

I like the way you think, Koopaul, but sometimes I feel this is barely enough for me. Sure, a lot of people told me I'm a kind and understanding person, but several other people called me annoying, insensitive, and toxic. The reason why I work so hard to gain respect is to remove those negative assumptions some people make and see me in a more positive light. Despite what some people say, I feel like I'm not trying hard enough and I'm doing something wrong.

(07-25-2013, 12:57 PM)Gors Wrote: My friends are all talented and shit, but it's not why I befriended them in first place. It's because they make me feel important as a human being, the mutual caring and the feeling of helping each other, that's what I appreciate in a friendship.

For some unknown reason, I tend to make friends pretty easily. Even though it's not as affective as it is offline, I still earn admiration from a lot of online people. What I like the most in a friend is being understanding and patent with me no matter what I go through. Of course, I contribute by not trying to be extremely annoying and not exploiting them for their talents. Since it's no secret that I'm egotistical, I have to try hard to keep that side of me at bay. Still, it's worth it to keep a pal or two and make some more.

(07-24-2013, 12:46 PM)E-Man Wrote: I'm not sure if anyone would agree to this opinion, but I think that what it means to be a nice guy is to act kind and fair to everyone, even to some of the people you don't exactly like

I'm going to be kinda harsh here, but even the nicest person doesn't have to like everyone, neither act kind if they don't feel like it. It may become some warped kind of kindess that's not from the heart. If some person doesn't like you... it's not because they're some terrible human being. Like Gorsal said, artistic talent and kidness have absolutely nothing in common, you can't exactly choose how your friends are. If you keep searching with rules in mind, nothing will ever come out of it.

(07-24-2013, 12:46 PM)E-Man Wrote: I look out for. Before anyone brings it up, I know that there are plenty of talented people who claim that they are friendly and all that, but even they can have their own flaws, which leads to them looking for reasons to not like me.

This makes it sound like it's the other party's fault for not liking you. Maybe it is, but maybe it also isn't. It's not exactly a flaw to not like someone else, you know.

(09-28-2013, 11:43 AM)Mutsukki Wrote: I'm going to be kinda harsh here, but even the nicest person doesn't have to like everyone, neither act kind if they don't feel like it. It may become some warped kind of kindess that's not from the heart. If some person doesn't like you... it's not because they're some terrible human being.

That may be so, but my biggest concern is the people how see me as the devil, yet they are extremely respected and capable of accomplishing more than I am able to. If they reach a certain level of fame and power, they would not hesitate to make my life heck in a hand basket. I realize this idea is farfetched, but I can't be too careful. Besides, I want to have those kind of people like me to remove any traces of myself people claim as "biased" or "toxic".

(09-28-2013, 11:43 AM)Mutsukki Wrote: This makes it sound like it's the other party's fault for not liking you. Maybe it is, but maybe it also isn't. It's not exactly a flaw to not like someone else, you know.

Well, I will admit that some flaws being the reason some people not liking me is a lofty assumption, so I wonder what you'll get out of some of the arguments I had with the people who dislike me. The worst part is that I don't know who is right or wrong, but I feel that I'm in the wrong almost all the time, which leads to insecurity.

(09-28-2013, 11:58 AM)E-Man Wrote: That may be so, but my biggest concern is the people how see me as the devil, yet they are extremely respected and capable of accomplishing more than I am able to. If they reach a certain level of fame and power, they would not hesitate to make my life heck in a hand basket. I realize this idea is farfetched, but I can't be too careful. Besides, I want to have those kind of people like me to remove any traces of myself people claim as "biased" or "toxic".

Why do you think all those people would go out of their way to make your life hell...? It's not only farfetched as it's really egocentrical (which I know you acnowkledge, but you keep doing it). You can't control how other people feel. If they don't like you, they don't! If you want to change that, maybe just try looking at yourself sometimes and see what can be or not be wrong...? That's still not 100% guaranteed that they'll ever like you. Change doesn't come overnight. Also you seem only concerned because the person is "better" than you. This is wrong.

(09-28-2013, 11:58 AM)E-Man Wrote: Well, I will admit that some flaws being the reason some people not liking me is a lofty assumption, so I wonder what you'll get out of some of the arguments I had with the people who dislike me. The worst part is that I don't know who is right or wrong, but I feel that I'm in the wrong almost all the time, which leads to insecurity.

Nobody's right or wrong. If you have people that like you the way you are, good! But not everyone will, and that's perfectly normal. Although if too many people (maybe including your friends) start to tell you something's wrong, maybe you should actually reflect upon that.

My other main concern is being unable to change no matter how hard I try. I'm aware that I keep acting ego-centrical (as you put it), but that evidence is good enough to show that part of me is never going to go away. I fear that since I have flaws that won't go away, this will keep me from being a morally better person.

Well that's definitely hard, I know. But if that really really bothers you and you're doing it for yourself and not for other people, just keep being aware of it and trying your best.

Also what is a "morally good person" anyway, you don't seem to disrupt anyone, they're just doing bad for yourself as far as I can see, so you shouldn't really worry about that

(09-28-2013, 11:43 AM)Mutsukki Wrote: I'm going to be kinda harsh here, but even the nicest person doesn't have to like everyone, neither act kind if they don't feel like it. It may become some warped kind of kindess that's not from the heart. If some person doesn't like you... it's not because they're some terrible human being

...

This makes it sound like it's the other party's fault for not liking you. Maybe it is, but maybe it also isn't. It's not exactly a flaw to not like someone else, you know.

Reminds me of the episode of Recess where TJ learns that there's one person who doesn't like him and tries everything to change the guy's opinion.

I've learned a lot from cartoons.

( http://www.watchcartoononline.com/recess...t-like-t-j )

You know, if Disney still made shows like that these days, a lot more people would have a wider set of morals. Too bad the current generation is forced to watch uninspired sitcoms by them... But since I'm bringing that up, that's besides the point of this topic.

Anyway, I think I remember that episode from ages ago and TJ ended up getting the guy's respect. For another example of a similar situation, how about the relationship between Ness and Porky? According to Chuggaconroy in one of his videos, Ness secretly wants Porky to be his friend, but he's a little sad because Porky doesn't like him back.

(09-28-2013, 05:24 PM)E-Man Wrote: Anyway, I think I remember that episode from ages ago and TJ ended up getting the guy's respect.

Actually at the end the kid still didn't like him and he just had to live with the fact that you can't make everyone like you