(01-01-2015, 06:45 PM)Sportoise Wrote: So Sakurai said this in an interview:
"Personally, I feel that if you want to play a fighting game seriously, there are other competitive fighting games that are more suited to that, and people like that could have fun playing those. If you play Smash Brothers seriously as a competitive game, the game itself has no future."

As someone who plays Smash competitively, fuck Sakurai. I love how his view on Smash seems to be "play however you want, unless you want to play it like this.

Personally, I actually agree with sakurai.

Honestly playing a game competitively kind of takes the fun away in a game. I find it more fun to play a game and keep messing around with the things in it to make it more enjoyable. plus with how much stuff sakurai actually puts into super smash bros for everyone to enjoy the game? it's incredible.

Then again I've never really cared much for the competitive gaming scenes anyway.

Well I mean that's fine and dandy, it's fine for you to have that opinion. However, part of the fun of a game is to play it as competitively as I can and be the very best at it. But saying everyone to enjoy isn't really right. The guy doesn't give a shit about competetive, and Brawl reflects that sentiment. Melee was a really great middle ground, you could still fuck around with buddies, and it's skill ceiling was high enough to where it could be played competitively. But Sakurai has something against competetive play, and as someone who likes to play competitively I feel kind of pissed

The point of a fighting game is to win.

Yeah, you can have tons of fun playing it, but the superior end result is victory over the other players. He seems to be disregarding this as truth.

(01-01-2015, 06:45 PM)Sportoise Wrote: So Sakurai said this in an interview:
"Personally, I feel that if you want to play a fighting game seriously, there are other competitive fighting games that are more suited to that, and people like that could have fun playing those. If you play Smash Brothers seriously as a competitive game, the game itself has no future."

As someone who plays Smash competitively, fuck Sakurai. I love how his view on Smash seems to be "play however you want, unless you want to play it like this.

I feel he means more like the game simply cannot compete to those other fighting games in a competitive aspect. The characters have various cherished histories, signature moves, personalities and the like, and it is already clear that there is lots of backlash when a decision is made to do something that a character may not be known for.

What it comes down to is the team is juggling character balance and character designs (combinations of their personality, signature abilities, etc), all while doing so for 50+ characters with a finite working time.

Lastly, it boils down to him just not wanting to do it. His statement is pretty much just saying that this game is going to plateau in its competitive aspects, and won't offer the kind of expansions that games like Street Fighter can offer.

I don't really see how you can get that, to be honest. It seemed to me like he was being pretty clear

Only as much as it means "Fuck you competitive gamers". They are just two different ways of saying "I don't think this game is going to hold up competitively compared to other games of the genre".

That's also all I have to say on it. No time for a looping conversation about Smash tonight.

It was mistranslated according to Smashboards.

Anyway I never saw the Smash Bros games in such a black-and-white. I always saw a gradient of competitive and casual play. It was never one or the other.
People would argue with me that its not competitive if you play on these stages or have these items or use these rules etc. Why should I let others define my experience?

(01-02-2015, 04:58 AM)Koopaul Wrote: People would argue with me that its not competitive if you play on these stages or have these items or use these rules etc. Why should I let others define my experience?

Do you really want to start this again, Koopaul? Because this conversation has gone on before, and you've shown you literally have no god-damned clue on what you're talking about. You're out of your fucking element Donnie, and Im not going to deal with your brand of Koopaul Bullshit™ on this subject. There's a good reason why items and stages are banned in competetive play, and if you took some time to look it up you'd understand why.

And yeah, I found out it was mistranslated earlier, that it wouldn't be good to focus a game on only competetive play. I understand that, as you wouldn't want a game focused exclusively on casual play either. It's not fair to exclude any of the two sides

(01-02-2015, 08:49 AM)Sportoise Wrote:

(01-02-2015, 04:58 AM)Koopaul Wrote: People would argue with me that its not competitive if you play on these stages or have these items or use these rules etc. Why should I let others define my experience?

Do you really want to start this again, Koopaul? Because this conversation has gone on before, and you've shown you literally have no god-damned clue on what you're talking about. You're out of your fucking element Donnie, and Im not going to deal with your brand of Koopaul Bullshit™ on this subject. There's a good reason why items and stages are banned in competetive play, and if you took some time to look it up you'd understand why.

Playing with items is okay. But the thing is that most of the items are designed with multiplayer (more than 2p) in mind. Invincibility stars are fun to run away from, because it forces the action elsewhere on the map. Instakill items are fun in multiplayer because the action shifts to knocking other players into their impending doom. Collecting items to build the air ride thing becomes a mad scramble, and that's fun because it's a little game in itself, with a fulfilling goal to collecting all its needed pieces.
There's satisfaction in using these items, and they're fun.
And while most are dodgeable, they just become a complete nuisance when you're playing against just one other person. it completely changes the flow of the game. oh, and they're random. it's now luck over skill.

"oh but kosheh why not just turn off the instakill items"

it's all in the same menu, and it's easier to just turn every item off now, that's why. also, no randomness - which is pretty much the backbone of competitive gaming, which is skill over luck.

Maybe if it was designed so items dropped at set time intervals, with increasing item lethality over time, they'd probably be seen in competitive play...but they're not. it's completely random. it's like competitive bumper cars.

(01-01-2015, 06:45 PM)Sportoise Wrote: So Sakurai said this in an interview:
"Personally, I feel that if you want to play a fighting game seriously, there are other competitive fighting games that are more suited to that, and people like that could have fun playing those. If you play Smash Brothers seriously as a competitive game, the game itself has no future."

As someone who plays Smash competitively, fuck Sakurai. I love how his view on Smash seems to be "play however you want, unless you want to play it like this.

As much as I agree with this (no-items play is bullshit), it's apparently a mistranslation and what he actually meant was more along the lines of "If we make Smash Bros ONLY to cater to the competitive crowd, the game has no future" meaning that if people wanna play it that way then good on them but they're not going to purposely cater only to the hardcore competitive crowd because the majority of its players still like to play with items and such.

In other words, he's saying that they're not going to cater to one or the other specifically, but instead both so everyone can play how they want.
...at least that's how I interpreted it...

(01-02-2015, 03:55 PM)Vipershark Wrote: (no-items play is bullshit)

Hey, I don't enjoy playing with items because item play is a lot more random, less emphasis on overall gameplay skill and the items become over-centralized. But fuck me, right?

I mean seriously, this is one of the few places I go to (other than r/Kappa, and even then it's for a different reason) where competitive Smash is shat on. I've often said that I don't mind how everyone else plays. If you enjoy high item spawn, coin matches, or friendly fire off, that great. Play it how you want. But please, can I, and the other handful of people on here that enjoy competitive Smash, get the same god damned courtesy?

I think it's bullshit but I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to play it or anything so uh
do what you want I guess?

We don't have to like the same things.

Or how about not flat out insulting it?

I think there's just a higher ratio of casual Smash players than competitive in this community.

As for people flat-out insulting it, the only person I can think of is Koopaul, which is one. Everyone else has been like "I don't like to play competitively" in a different vocabulary.

uhh i think youre making this a bit too personal, sportoise.

as a competitive player myself, (im more of a watcher but w/e) i don't like items all that much. vipershark doesnt like the fact that competitive players dont use items, and thats ok. i mean, its not like hes changing competitive smash...