(04-16-2015, 11:23 AM)Pik Wrote:

(04-13-2015, 07:17 AM)Gors Wrote: I think it's worthy to note that in Japan, the popular aesthetic is still the 'kawaii' - that means, cute characters.

So you're telling me... this DK design would make him a hit in Japan..

id absolutely lose my shit if kisekae DK was in an actual nintendo game

(04-16-2015, 03:13 PM)StarSock64 Wrote: Imagine if Luigi suddenly wasn't a coward and acted exactly like Mario. You might think it was cool at first, but in the long run he'd lose all individuality and appeal. Characterization is really important to cartoon guys like this

I feel like I'm going off-topic here, but that already was kind of a thing already. Prior to Smash 64, when Luigi wasn't given his own extensive set of voice clips, he wasn't a coward and just acted exactly like Mario for the longest time, because he had little to no characterization. A good example of this is the comparison of Mario 64 Luigi to Smash 64 Luigi (it's also probably because Charles Martinet "lost" Luigi's voice forever, lol)

But, I feel like generally with Nintendo games, it's easier to just try to drop any ideas related to characterization, or how "this character" should act in one series or another. They'll have personalities, yes, but even that's subject to change. I think Miyamoto stated it once, and even Koopaul in an argument here: the Mario cast acts more as a "troupe" of actors, kind of like Popeye....and Donkey Kong is no exception. That's why you'll have Mario and Donkey Kong gettin' steamed at one another in MvDK games and then suddenly they're chummy in Mario Kart. It's also probably the reason Bowser doesn't just slam Mario's head into the pavement, either (it'd save him a lot of work in the core series)

In Nintendo's game producers' viewpoint, gameplay generally comes first and its lexicon comes second; what works in one series doesn't necessarily dictate the character's design and intention until the end of time. If that were the case, NoA probably would've been heavily hinting at Mario having an actual position in royalty all of these years post-SMB1 (sort of like since the Indigo League, every time Ash goes to a new region in the Pokemon cartoon, 4kids would always heavily imply that Ash's female travel partner was secretly hot for him that's never existed in the Japanese localization; it's just weird "official speculation")

tl;dr donkey kong's characterization doesn't quite dictate him because every spinoff game in the series sets a different mood for him. it seems like post-Rare he's been all about breaking shit and pre-Rare he's been pretty much Grant Kirkhope's role as him personified: "okay".

...and then you've got DK King of Swing, where he is...a very patient jumper with great occupational (hand) control who enjoys spinning around on a peg with one hand and kindly waits his turn to jump to the next peg


EDIT: also if every appearance of these characters contributed to their actual lexicon, the Amada storybook anime would be considered canon, and so would this

let's talk about King of Swing for a minute.

fuck king of swing.

That is all.

Yeah, Luigi used to be like that, but he was also boring, so I guess that just demonstrates my point, ahah.

I think those earlier Luigis at least had the benefits of iconic design, good artwork and an engaging world, but that wouldn't be enough for all mascot game characters if the other stuff in their games didn't make up for the gaps, especially in modern times. I also don't think DK's design is anywhere near as iconic and i think his renders are often bad, so I don't think he can get by on those alone anyway...

I don't want to get into the benefits of consistent characterization right now, but I wanna leave some other food for thought.

I think part of DK's problem is that the older games aren't very accessible because the presentation is weird, and anything as atmospheric as DKC isn't going to appeal to everyone the way a happy cartoon world might .

The new ones that try to be accessible end up seeming lackluster compared to everything else because they look like a worse version of everything else. I haven't played the new games, but it's partly because from a glance, everything looks B-tier and lacking in personal identity. I can't help but think I'm not the only one who got this impression.

The main characters give me the impression of lame background characters in a pixar movie and the new enemies may as well be from something as lacking in relevance as ty the tasmanian tiger, because they look replaceable and generic.

I could be completely wrong, but it's not going to catch my attention when more iconic games exist, and people can't like your series if they don't even try it. I'm not saying it's good or bad; I'm saying it's a possible contributor to its lack of recognition...

I'm going to have to agree that a consistent personality only benefits a character. A character's role can change, yes. But their personality should stay consistent. Even when Bowser is having a friendly game of golf with Mario, he's still a big mean brute. This helps them become icons in the public's eyes.

Unfortunately, DK's personality keeps being juggled around depending on the developer. This, I think, has hurt him. People don't know what to think of the guy!

I think if they kept DK the fun loving goofball type more people would like him. He can still act tough and angry in front of his enemies, I don't think that changes anything. But otherwise this is a guy who should be seen relaxing eating a banana while listening to some jams.

Anyway, like DK64 or not, it is the game that gives the Kong's the most personality. Their animations, voice acting, and comical scenarios really make these guys shine.

Donkey Kong Country is truly perfect. If you do not get this new generation of Donkey Kong madness, YOU ARE STUPID. Yes I know, that's insulting... but it's also the truth.

Wow hey everyone hate me for saying this, but I've yet to actually like any "country" style Donkey Kong game


The SNES titles have always really bugged me on several levels, both graphics and design-wise. The controls were very loose and "slippery," meaning that over corrected jumps and missed landings were common, which was also contributed by the fact that in many levels the foreground props would blend, albeit near seamlessly, with the backgrounds, making judging distances and spacial awareness difficult.

As far as later titles go, I really have no love for them either.

Well I happen to love almost all the Donkey Kong games. But I now realize that there are two different discussions taking place. Yes I can't believe I didn't think of this.

One discussion is talking about the actual games.
The other discussion is about the character and world.

Someone might love DKC the game, but not really care that much about the characters or world.

I was stupidly assuming that if someone loved the game, they must also love the character. My topic starting post is completely pointless. But atleast it opened the door to some interesting insight.

(04-17-2015, 07:16 PM)Sevenstitch Wrote: Wow hey everyone hate me for saying this, but I've yet to actually like any "country" style Donkey Kong game


The SNES titles have always really bugged me on several levels, both graphics and design-wise. The controls were very loose and "slippery," meaning that over corrected jumps and missed landings were common, which was also contributed by the fact that in many levels the foreground props would blend, albeit near seamlessly, with the backgrounds, making judging distances and spacial awareness difficult.

As far as later titles go, I really have no love for them either.

I...actually thought the controls in the SNES Country games were surprisingly tight. They're not New Super Mario Bros. Wii tight, but it's decent enough handling for the SNES generation where I love the absolute shit out of 'em

DK in the new, Wii game (and the new one, too actually - Tropical Freeze. I own both) just feels like you're throwing a slice of salami against a greased watermelon because all the controls are swapped.


Why the hell would you have pressure-based movement in a sidescroller. The game sorely needs a run button because I shouldn't always be running in a precision platformer.
Sure Sonic doesn't need a run button but DK sure as hell does