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+--- Thread: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective (/thread-27003.html)
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Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Koh - 04-15-2015
This is mostly a public opinion survey about a game design aspect my game development partner and I have thought would be a great implementation for most of our games.
So, the idea we want to work with is that at the start of the game, the player gets to choose whose perspective they wish to follow of the main characters. In other words, they choose who they want to play as, and only directly control that character through the whole game, as well as experiencing the story from that character's perspective. So this means, for example, when the party members split up for whatever reasons over the course of the game, the player gets to experience what the other characters were up to at that point in time, if they play the game as a different character.
We feel this would add an extra great layer of replayability, as well as giving all the characters a chance to shine in their own right. But I can also see the skepticism some people would have about playing through the whole game again, and experiencing like 70% of the same content again just for the sake of the above. What are your thoughts? This survey will help us think about this design choice more.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Omegajak - 04-15-2015
I don't have a problem with that. Isn't that exactly what Sonic 2 and Knuckles Sonic 3 and Knuckles and Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 is known for? Those games went over pretty well, I've heard. Plus it's you Koh, I'd play anything you were drawing twice just to see if I missed anything or catch the Easter Eggs.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Jermungandr - 04-15-2015
I love it when games do that, personally. Particularly when each character has a unique skill that lets them access areas or scenarios that others cannot. This however can be a bit of a nightmare on the game designer's end, fair warning. The more characters to play, the more interesting the game, and more replay value is added, however designing the levels around all their unique traits without allowing any of them to "break" the intended game flow is very difficult and requires exponentially more testing. So just as a suggestion for your own sanity, if this is your first time trying something like this, I wouldn't involve more than two or three playable characters. If you want to do more than that, you can always do so in a sequel, using the first game as practice.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - daemoth - 04-15-2015
Yeah, this is a great concept. One of my favorite rpg, Star Ocean: The Second Story, use it and it wouldnt be as great without it.
Especially since the perpecstive between the two choosable characters is very different. One is Claude McKenny, an earthling, travelling on a spaceship for the "federation" whos gets traped on expel. The other is Rena Landford, an expellian, a innocent young woman with mysterious healing powers, who has lived most of her life in a medieval-ish town.
So Claude knows a lot more about how the universe works, science, laws of physics, the fact that there are worlds behinds the stars. But at the same time, he cant (supposed to not) tell anyone on expel about it because of the federation.
If you wanna check out the story of SO the second story, they made an anime out of it:
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Kriven - 04-15-2015
I'd say it depends on the length of each individual campaign... if going through the story once took me forty hours, I'm less likely to do it again anytime soon.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - psychospacecow - 04-15-2015
Its a good question. I guess it largely depends on how much the content would differ based solely on the change. I mean, you could almost do that in GTA 5 (almost), but it wouldn't amount to anything. Kingdom Hearts Rechain of memories did this but it was treated as a separate mode.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - puggsoy - 04-15-2015
(04-15-2015, 03:39 PM)psychospacecow Wrote: Its a good question. I guess it largely depends on how much the content would differ based solely on the change.
Basically this, yeah. It would have to be different enough to warrant replaying as each character, but still similar enough to show the cool way that the stories are related. Alternate endings would also help (as opposed to, say, at the end the characters meet up again and it turns out the same each time).
I haven't played any games that do this but I would certainly love to if it's done well.
Also, a similar design could be to make it one story, but you switch between characters in each "chapter". Similar to how the Animorphs book series had each book from a different character's point of view (although due to there being more books than characters, it tended to cycle through them). It doesn't have the same replayability factor, but it would be an interesting way of presenting a story, if you do it properly. I'm not saying you should do this instead though, it's just a related idea that I got.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - daemoth - 04-15-2015
(04-15-2015, 09:36 PM)puggsoy Wrote: Also, a similar design could be to make it one story, but you switch between characters in each "chapter". Similar to how the Animorphs book series had each book from a different character's point of view (although due to there being more books than characters, it tended to cycle through them). It doesn't have the same replayability factor, but it would be an interesting way of presenting a story, if you do it properly. I'm not saying you should do this instead though, it's just a related idea that I got.
The game Odin sphere on Ps2 does exactly this. There are 5 chapter, and you control a different characters for each. The story take place in Asgard right before the ragnarok, and you see how each faction view each other. During the final chapter, there are 5 boss, and you choose who fight which. And if you choose the correct combination, you get the perfect ending.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - psychospacecow - 04-15-2015
Depending how you look at it, you could also say Chrono Cross does this, although technically speaking, you're still the same person, just not physically.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Koh - 04-16-2015
The one thing I don't want to do is having a select screen pop up so you can experience all the characters point of view at the same point in time. This style of game story telling makes the game feel disconnected to me, because instead of continuously experiencing the plot from someone's perspective, you're jumping all around bits and pieces from different character perspectives, and the flow is destroyed.
But I have read the posts so far, and there are some interesting notions presented. Thanks for the replies so far guys, and to any future ones.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Pik - 04-16-2015
Didn't Live A Live for SNES do something like this? I haven't played it myself, but from I hear it's praised for its multiple character stories.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - daemoth - 04-16-2015
(04-16-2015, 11:29 AM)Pik Wrote: Didn't Live A Live for SNES do something like this? I haven't played it myself, but from I hear it's praised for its multiple character stories.
However, the different stories take place in different times and settings so they dont really have anything to do with each other.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - E-Man - 04-16-2015
Out of all the notable games that handles the different points of views for characters, it makes me wonder why nobody thought to bring up Seiken Densetsu 3 (or what is pretty much the Secret of Mana 2) yet. I haven't played much of the game in years, but from what I know, it follows the basic main story no matter which characters you choose from the beginning; however, choosing which characters you play as affect story elements in the plot. Not only does it dramatically affect the opening of the game, but also I've come to understand that you'll fight different bosses. When I still had access to the game years ago (back in 2005), I frequently started different playthroughs to see the prologues of each character. That way, I'll be able to piece some of the plot details together, such as understand why the ninjas are attacking that warrior tribe in the mountains.
It's a shame I didn't get very far in that game because I was unable to figure out how to get the fire spirit guy to light up the way to the dwarves' place in order to get gunpowder for the cannon.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - TomGuycott - 04-16-2015
Seiken Densetsu 3 is an example of what I would consider a good representation of this idea in concept, but it fails in execution because of the game's length.
The game has six playable heroes, and at the start of the game you can pick one main hero and two secondaries. Each main hero has a unique opening story, and following that all the storylines will follow more or less the same path, same bosses, same goals, UNTIL the moment you get the mana sword.
The story then changes based on your main hero. There are three possible endgames, two heroes a piece that will unlock it. The final three bosses (and some bosses that are rematches) are determined by your hero in lead. Also, heroes present for certain scenes will make them play out slightly differently through the entire game.
Now here lies the problem: the game is long. Arguably longer than it's predecessor. Not only are there six heroes which can be interchanged, three sets of final bosses and countless scene combos, but there are also branching classes. It ultimately just changes palettes and final attacks and equipment, but also stats and other meta game stuff. You can go one route down a good or evil class, and then each of those paths gets a new good or evil class EACH. That's 7 classes per character including their starting class.
In a game that's. 40-60 hours a playthrough, that is a lot to invest in a game and not to get burned out eventually. It is something I would recommend coming back to someday, though.
RE: Game Design Survey: Choosing Perspective - Maxpphire - 04-17-2015
I guess the best thing to ask yourself is this: "Is creating that much more work worth it?"
It will be if you do it right, but it will also be a lot of work you're doing. Probably much more then you can currently scope out.
Myself? I would totally play a game like this provided that the game's story and the character development is so much more then average, meaning you better have talented as hell writers working on it.
That being said I wish you luck!