Suggestion: Better NSFW Handling?

[Gors]

Add a system toggle in tSR that hides all NSFW content from updates and gallery. Kinda like Google's Safe Search system.

[Dazz]

Probably a good move, actually. I'm not sure how we could implement it in an easy to use way...
If anybody has some thoughts, I'd love to hear more.

[Gors]

in a very simple wording, it would involve using the tags to detect whether or not those can be hidden. For ease of use, it should display the number of sheets hidden in the update or the browsed page (say, if a game has a section with 10 sheets but one of them is NSFW,then 9 will be displayed with a small text saying "1 out of 10 sheets were hidden. To unhide, change your user account settings"). This is so that people don't get confused on why the game has no sheet entries despite appearing on the index, for example.

This should also take the user's age into account, so members under age of 18 automatically have their NSFW filters on by default.

The NSFW filter should only be applied to sheets only, not NSFW games, because even NSFW games can have SFW data, such as HUD, NPCs and effects. Of course, if all entries in the NSFW also happens to be NSFW, then all should be hidden with the text "12 out of 12 sheets were hidden. To unhide, change your user account settings" being displayed, as usual.

I know that tSR is not a porn site but due to the nature of the game graphics, a underage kid can easily find all NSFW games and have access to them. Having this block at least gives the site actual legal ground should people get mad at us for "distributing free porn for kids"

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Of course this might be difficult to implement but it's how most sites that deal wth images do it, and imo it's the best way.

[Petie]

Implementation of the filtering itself shouldn't be too hard as the sheets are already marked as NSFW or not directly. A select where not NSFW would give all of the "safe" sheets and we could get a count either from the difference on the select all or by selecting the number of NSFW directly. Displaying that message in a consistent way would be a little tricky but definitely not impossible either.

The issues arise when you start factoring in default state and age. Remember that an account isn't necessary to browse the site. Do we blanket hide NSFW data and require an account to view it? Do we not tie it to an account and instead use a cookie (like view mode)? Do we continue showing it with the filter when you're logged out and ignore the new system entirely? And automating this change when a user turns 18 is far easier said than done too unless your intent was to not be able to opt out if you're under 18 but in that case, people will just make new accounts.

Answers to the concerns in that second paragraph will be important before we can start implementing something like this. All of that said though, we're already hiding that content by default and to be perfectly honest, I'm not 100% convinced that taking content censorship this far is completely necessary in the end. I'm open to explanations as to why it is though.

[Gors]

Remember that an account isn't necessary to browse the site. Do we blanket hide NSFW data and require an account to view it?

Either by requiring an account or having the user click a prompt disclaimer saying that the content stored in the gallery may not be suitable to minors every time a new instance of the page is opened (that is, if you close your browser and reopen it). Ofc if you're registered, over 18 and with the Safe Search disabled, this is not needed.

Do we continue showing it with the filter when you're logged out and ignore the new system entirely?

If you log out then you should be treated like a newcomer. Click on the disclaimer, or relog to gain access.

And automating this change when a user turns 18 is far easier said than done too unless your intent was to not be able to opt out if you're under 18 but in that case, people will just make new accounts.

You can always have it off by default, and when the age is 18, they earn the option to disable the filter. It doesn't need to be fully automated, just a notice like "when you're 18, you can disable NSFW filter if you want." As for user making new accounts, this can be said of pretty much anything. Let's be honest, people have made alts for stuff other than viewing blocked images, people making alts will never end. But at least by enforcing those rules, tSR as a whole will be perceived as a safer environment where people can browse freely as long as they abide to the disclaimers. (and will make these types of threads completely baseless to boot).

As it is right now, newcomers are able to easily find NSFW content, as the thumbnails aren't hidden, and hiding them in their page doesn't prohibit anyone from accessing it - and without a very clear disclaimer, it just doesn't give the site a proper legal footing. Dedicated porn sites ask you if you're 18, and while I know that tSR is not a porn site, I don't think it is smart to let these things slide. People can always interpret things the wrong way, so I think it's better safe than sorry.

In the end, it's not that you're limiting access to the content - you still will have them on the gallery, but just like a video rental shop, the adult titles are tucked away in a age restricted part. Any irregular usage of the rules is the user's fault.

[Kendotlibero]

i have not a lot of experience, but a filtering tool from what i've learnt in the university it's pretty easy and not that difficoult to implement.

[Petie]

It sounds to me like you're suggesting making this impossible to turn off until you're 18 which I'm not sure I agree with. But even if that's not the case, I still don't know if this is necessary. The way I view this entire situation is that we get exceedingly few complaints about inappropriate content, especially since implementing the click-to-reveal system. These changes are pretty heavy-handed and will negatively impact the user experience for everyone (including the vast majority that don't care about this content to begin with). Most of our visitors don't have accounts and for them, this will be a constant annoyance if implemented the way you're suggesting.

You said it yourself - we're not a porn site. We don't have anything even remotely as explicit as you'd find on a site where a system like this, implemented the way you described, is necessary. Most of what we have marked as NSFW is mildly inappropriate or so small and pixelated that it certainly couldn't be taken for porn.

With respect to making new accounts, I'm well aware that people make alts all the time for various reasons but that doesn't mean that we should be creating a system where it's encouraged. If there's no way to disable this before you turn 18, anyone who realizes there is content they can't see will simply abandon the account and make one with a fake birthday. Sure, that covers us legally but I don't think we have any content that could get us into any legal hot water regardless, especially given the fact that you have to willingly and manually un-hide that content to begin with.

Edit:

i have not a lot of experience, but a filtering tool from what i've learnt in the university it's pretty easy and not that difficoult to implement.

Filtering the content isn't difficult. It's everything else I've mentioned that makes this project a tad less simple to work with.

[Gors]

even then I still advocate for a method that hides NSFW uploads, so that the user has a completely safe environment to browse. You still have kids browsing the forum and having the update icons can be really embarassing and/or risky for the user.

You can tool with the limitations all you want, what I said is only a way to implement it, I just don't think that everyone feels at ease when a good percentage of the updates are comprised of ahegao loli girls.

(these areall in the current update, on the first page, and I was not logged in; thus viewing it as a new visitor)

Granted, everything being discussed here is prone to subjective analysis and you might not think those are that bad. But I think that a thorough thinking is necessary before dismissing it as "not needed".

tSR is not a porn site, but it has unsuitable material for minors. It's good to think about their health and good usage of the site.

[Petie]

I didn't say the entire idea was unneeded - just that the heavy-handed approach was over the top. I would not be against outright hiding NSFW content from the main page if that would be a suitable compromise though.

[Kosheh]

I'm going to say I had a bit of a laugh here imagining Little Timmy making an account just to view some pixel boobies

Do we blanket hide NSFW data and require an account to view it? Do we not tie it to an account and instead use a cookie (like view mode)? Do we continue showing it with the filter when you're logged out and ignore the new system entirely? And automating this change when a user turns 18 is far easier said than done too unless your intent was to not be able to opt out if you're under 18 but in that case, people will just make new accounts.

I'm not sure if you're asking this rhetorically, but I think the best, easiest course of action would be using cookies - certain other image-hosting websites do this and I think this is probably enough to cover your bum. If there turns out to be issues that stem from it (i.e. angry Christian moms sending colorful emails to Dazz about Little Timmy looking at pixel boobies) then you may want to consider requiring an account to view it.

This would also be best as you can pretty much just...visit TSR at a public place without worrying about seeing NSFW content.

Even better would be to, on a per-profile basis, disable thumbnails for NSFW content by default and enable them only through going to your site profile and checking a box like "Enable thumbnails of NSFW content". Clicking this would require the user to go through a blow-by screen saying "Yes, let me turn on NSFW thumbnails".
Having both options, while initially seeming redundant gives users two lines of defense against those pesky pixel boobies: The cookies (which work for the first sign-in on ANY machine, and is the first line of defense if you forget to unclick "Enable NSFW") and the "Enable" button on the profile (which protect against angry moms)
(and I know how much you dislike redundant features Petie I'm sorry but really dude hear me out on this)

the best option would be adding a third feature; one that gives you a high five for having two excellent lines of defense against getting fired over cartoon honkers




y'all gotta stop thinking of them as "restrictions" and instead as "deterrents"

[Gors]

that's why I said it this:

You can tool with the limitations all you want, what I said is only a way to implement it,

Those are all suggestions, you know more than anyone else how the site database works, so ultimately the design would have to be done by you. I can try spitballing for more ideas but they'll be only that, ideas.

Maybe if you talk with other staff people you'll be able to find a balance between usability and safe browsing.

[Petie]

Moving this to its own thread for the sake of keeping organized. I'd definitely like to hear feedback from other staff (and members as well). I don't think hiding NSFW content from the home page would be a bad idea and I do think a cookie would be the best way to go about doing this so non-members still have the option to disable it (though that obviously complicates things a little for shared computers). I don't like the idea of every new session requiring clicking through a warning - I think that's over the top - but perhaps the cookie can expire after a week instead of a year, for instance.

I also actually like Kosheh's idea to just blanket hide the thumbnails and leave the rest of our system for NSFW content in place. That would be plenty easy to implement and I guess can also be toggled with a cookie for non-members. So I'll end this with a set of questions then:

1. Do you think we need better handling of NSFW content or is the current system enough?
2. If you do think we need better handling of NSFW content, should we hide just the thumbnails or the content as a whole?
3. Should disabling this filter require an account or should it be available to all visitors?
4. Should visitors under 18 be able to disable this filter themselves? (this feature implies that the toggle is account-based)
5. Regardless of the above, should we hide NSFW content from the main page update?

If anyone has anything to add, please do so.

[Kendotlibero]

i'd add a better clarification on allowed NSFW content, because from experience not everithing lewd is permitted.
Honestly i'm good with everithing we decide, as long it's consistent
If I have to give an opinion, Everything porn is allowed, and let's add a system for hiding it from 18+ people and people that don't want it

[Davy Jones]

1. The current system is a warning on the icon and a warning after you clicked on it. This applies to all users who are not logged in. If you're logged in, the second warning vanishes, which is a bit unfortunate. Reason is, when you click on "Recently uploaded sheets" on the main site, you're also not having the first warning because the icons are not visible. The file name does not always give the content away, so maybe a few improvements wouldn't hurt.

2. The thumbnails for NSFW sheets are SFW, so I would rather hide the contents.

3. Should be available to all visitors, toggling NSFW content can be saved in the browser cookies.

4. It's the internet, there is no way to hinder Little Timmy from making himself an adult.

5. If the NSFW toggler mentioned above gets implemented, then people click the icons on their own responsibility. Having them in the updates or not is more a matter of "TVGR has also erotic/gore content" or "I can only see the tip of the iceberg but I know there is some naughty content hidden in the caves". I think it's more a reputation thingy.

[Gors]

4. It's the internet, there is no way to hinder Little Timmy from making himself an adult.

this is correct, but if the forum itself has the rule against porn and it is oriented to 13 year olds and over (that is, underaged people) it is not fair to "make little Timmy a man" like this. This should happen anywhere else, not tSR.