Programming languages and software design interfaces

[DarkGrievous7145]

text wall, ignore if not interested:

Spoiler

warning: the order/details of these events may be off, my memory is fuzzy

I originally gained an actual interest in programming due to a video on youtube about batch script and using it for hacking school computers, and making fake BSODs and shit.
(ofc, batch isn't exactly a "programming language" , but it's still possible to create programs with it)

I tried at one time to learn C++ , this failed pretty badly.

I think the next thing I learned was html.
I self-taught myself the basics, but I don't remember where

I have actually made games on Sploder ,
and I've attempted it with Game Maker. Many of the gmk projects have failed. I still occasionally use gmk to test proof of concept when I don't have the time to write all the code to actually make something work.
Also tried out Python with PyGame, but this went south. Once I tried to add sprite animation and shit, FAIL!


I did take web design, I think my sophomore year in high school, but the first bit was catch-up, and the second bit was using DreamWeaver, a program I've since learned to hate quite a lot due to both limitations, and some of the code it outputs

I learned css from a combination of youtube and w3schools.

I learned JavaScript on youtube, specifically from TheNewBoston's videos. Up until then, the only JS I had even seen was obfuscated and/or minimized, and I couldn't make sense of it. I later learned html5 from him.

After learning about flash decompilers and Adobe Flash, I started to learn at least how to understand actionscript 1,2 and 3.
For as basic stuff, I can read and write as1 and as2.
as3 I can typically read, but I have yet to write any.

I've made a few attempts at Java.

I have tried some Assembly, but unlikely I'll do much with it.
I've forgotten everything I learned from the tutorial series I checked-out... lol!
I have joked with one of my friends about making an open source program to do something really cool,
in pure assembly (or in an esolang). For the sole purpose of pissing people off when they want/need to edit it.

I learned enough TI Basic to be dangerous. There were a few occasions after learning how to use it that I was busy writing some program instead of doing my Financial Algebra work lol! I have since downloaded the Wabbit emu and a copy of the ...which was it? I think TI-84 BIOS or ROM or whatever. I haven't messed with it since completing highschool. However, I might continue, eventually. One program I wrote with this was a simple, but effective memory hog. I think the teacher had to pull the batteries to reset it, iirc. My ultimate goal was to program a game, after I'd seen many people in my Algebra class playing games when I was a freshman. But, it took up till my senior year to even learn how to program simple shit, so...no games D: (admittedly, I didn't make any effort to learn it till senior year)

I started, but presently have abandoned, Processing.

That's the best i can come-up with for my roots/history with programming/hacking/whatever...

I agree it should be up to the programmer or artist what tools they use. What annoys me, though, is that when people say these programs are "easy" , or "instant happiness" , is that it simply is not the case. To get something really good, and not mediocre, there must be some kills present.

As for the auto-completion thing in some IDE'S/code editors, I tend to find this annoying sometimes, since they make, or try to make, the wrong guess.

I personally use notepad++ for the bulk of my code.

As for languages, I currently have been writing programs in JavaScript.
Being a member of Crystalien Redux, I do still write ActionScript code, also, but due to my computer situation, I can't compile it myself.

I hope to learn Haxe or how to write/use AS3 (besides actually make my own thing entirely from scratch with any version of AS).
I'm interested in C# or actually finishing something with Java.
If only because a lot of programs tend to use it, Python probably wouldn't hurt. I think half of what has happened there was its white space sensitivity.
I may or may not finish with at least, basic Assembly, or with Processing.

there's some goals

My preferences for a programming/scripting language (finding all is like, impossible):
flexible
not painful to use
not overly quirky
easy to debug/test
stable
fast
lots of features

So far, I really don't like JavaScript, especially when trying to do OOP. I know there's ways to, but I'm not ABOUT to manually type the code that makes it 'truly' behave this way. My present computer situation is partially why I've been using it so much. On the bright side, it's extremely easy to test.

ActionScript seems alright, and Flash has many of the things I like. It out-performs JS significantly. The two major flawa are that the IDE can easily crash (esp. on larger .fla's) , and that testing can be really slow when re-compiling a fairly large amount of code or assets.

Java's live debugging is wonderful, however there are a lot of things that presently confuse me about how it really works. I've heard the perforamnce and security also is questionable. (ofc, this makes me wonder why in the hell, and idc HOW much security they've laid on top, BANKS use it extensively.) The fact it's now almost universally blacklisted on web browsers (especially the unsigned applets) really pisses me off. I want to make some web games or programs in my time, so just that reason now makes me reluctant. The Eclipse IDE does seem to take a fairly large amount of resources. I can't seem to do much with it running. At least, this was last time I used it on my desktop. It was rather inconvenient with me trying to follow a tutorial, however. (besides hinders my music options if I want entertainment)

tl;dr:
It definitely should be up to the individual what they use. Even mediocre tools/languages/technologies can do incredible things if the programmer knows how to use them to their fullest potential. Although, if there's a 100% legitimate reason not to use the language, especially for your purposes, it might be best to not use that language. For example, making an MMO with batchscript, just to name a very extreme case. (I've seen, however... some amazing shit written purely in batch. And what shit I've seen, I have tremendous respect to anyone who can make it do the stuff it was doing.)

And the people arguing that just using, or having been exposed a certain language is bad/wrong...IRRITATING.
I dealt with one of these on youtube a few months back. Someone did an "hour of code" video with the Codebug.
There was this whole comment chain about how the drag 'n drop editors, and languages like BASIC were inferior/aren't effective at teaching, and one person went over the top and said the programmers or would be programmers with prior experience to this are already mentally corrupted just for that exposure. The thing with drag 'n drops is absolutely nothing to do with this method of coding, it's that the features are limited to whatever the underlying pre-built library/engine supports. It's obviously far from impossible to implement a fully functional drag 'n drop tool for any of the existing programming languages out there. It's just that no one has done it. (to my knowledge, anyways) As for the being mentally fucked for life, I simply refuse to believe this. Those that truly are dedicated, and want to improve, probably will. It might take some time, however. Even those that stick to the "bad/useless" stuff might create some impressive and quite functional applications with it, and develop a mastery of it. The individual to whom I made my point got into an argument over my miss-use of the word "racist". I pointed out there's not even a need to classify 20 versions of the same concept, in this case, discrimination. Anyways, after that, they continued to justify their discrimination, and eventually, one of us quit replying, forgot who. But yeah, that pissed me off, being both from the kind of programming background that apparently is "bad" , and having friends in the same boat.