Parole

[Sengir]

tbh "You're a bunch of stupid, naive masochists who apparently love being abused by the same people over and over again" doesnt really carry the message of "the staff made a bad decision"

that my unban is this straw that broke the camels back and your claim to "knowing me personally" and using that as a reason why your judgement supersedes the forum staff's is all really blatant evidence that this is personal. skelesam came back a day before i made the CherryBerry alt. he and you have personal history. and yet it wasnt until i was unbanned that you broke a 9-month hiatus to warn the "stupid, naive masochists" and "horrible" prominent members of the userbase. that doesnt fly at all. i mean you have a law video game character in your avatar; your argument of "dont unban sengir" is definitely a valid prosecution but your case is flimsier than a white corn tortilla and you totally know that. my one chance (blank) was banned after a very mild argument with kriven (which is hilarious considering theres a literal political debate topic open right now and its way rougher than calling someone a bad word over their views on the philosophy of authorship). heck, viper admitted to not wanting blank to be active at all. so if you can list every other chance (ban-on-sight isnt a chance) i'd be down to listen, but blank's most important crime was dodging a self-imposed ban which makes it already an iffy "chance"


again, id be happy to chat over PMs since this is very obviously personal despite "i dont care"s followed by "i know her"s and childhood anecdotes

[StarSock64]

tbh "You're a bunch of stupid, naive masochists who apparently love being abused by the same people over and over again" doesnt really carry the message of "the staff made a bad decision"

"You're a batch of idiots who keep shooting yourselves in the foot" isn't equivalent to me saying the staff made a bad decision. Right. Great reading comprehension skills.

I didn't say me knowing some stuff about you made my judgment suprecede others. Others said THEIR supposed "context" and "behind the scenes" made THEIR JUDGMENT supercede MINE, and I said I could play that card too if I wanted, but I find it utterly meaningless and found it hard to believe ANY context they could have would justify the decision regardless of what that context supposedly is. Basically I was saying "don't go there"

"I bandodged repeatedly sure, but I still totally deserve a second chance literally the day after i did it again right?" no, I mean that kind of behavior is perfect justification not to unban someone and I would leave them, whoever they were, banned until they learned to stop acting like a spoiled brat

[Maxpphire]

I'm not really happy Claire is back.

That's all I have to say.

[Sengir]

@starsock
im a spoiled brat but my first several posts after being unbanned were (at least attempts at) legitimate contribution to conversation in several threads across the forum

youve posted more in this thread the last 2 days than the last entire year and its just to throw a tissy that im unbanned from a forum you already admittedly left (which you say is because "trolls" (i never trolled, i bandodged and im pretty sure (aside from the dick pics) thats less "harassment"/"trolling" than "breaking forum rules") keep getting unbanned, yet my unbanning has already made you more active than you have been in the last 12 months which really makes your protestation that this isnt personal look fraudulent)

so i have a question: if im re-banned will you come back? if the staff makes the "right decision" will you be an active member? or did you come back just to get me re-banned and leave? this isnt a rhetorical question im legit curious what your "angle" is here

@max
ok

edit: i play by a new set of rules now. it's called THINK

Spoiler

ok thats a meme but its a wholesome meme so

[StarSock64]

i never trolled, i bandodged and im pretty sure (aside from the dick pics) thats less "harassment"/"trolling" than "breaking forum rules"

I mean, repeatedly breaking the rules like it's no big deal sounds like trolling to me

yet my unbanning has already made you more active than you have been in the last 12 months which really makes your protestation that this isnt personal look fraudulent

It wouldn't make my points any less valid either way. But seriously, stupid decisions making me angry is nothing new, I've gotten involved in several things like this in the past. I think last time I got mad because of a decision regarding the lounge or something, which I didn't even really use.

so i have a question: if im re-banned will you come back? if the staff makes the "right decision" will you be an active member?

Obviously not? Why is this even a question?

did you come back just to get me re-banned and leave? this isnt a rhetorical question im legit curious what your "angle" is here

See post #45

[~Axis~]

Ok so im reading through this entire thread, just trying to understand whats causing this argument here. I honestly just cant find the damn point. I dont care if i know about the topic or not, but i know that giving someone a chance is not a weakness at all. Even if someone just spent hours and hours of shitposting in the past and got banned for it, i would give them a second chance eventually if they wanted one to see if they genuinely changed. If they did then good, if not then ban. All im hearing rn is "You let that member back in...? Oh?? Someone's gotta whip you into shape son." Followed by "I dont give a shit but i do." If anything the way the point is being given is unnecessary.

[StarSock64]

I dont care if i know about the topic or not

Maybe you should, so that you don't sound like a complete idiot

i know that giving someone a chance is not a weakness at all. Even if someone just spent hours and hours of shitposting in the past and got banned for it, i would give them a second chance eventually if they wanted one to see if they genuinely changed. If they did then good, if not then ban.

Yeah that sounds nice, doesn't it? Gee, I didn't even consider that

I'm glad everything is so simple in your world

This site has a history of trying exactly what you said (as has been already stated), but the problem is that these people are really only interested in screwing with everybody for fun, so they skirt the rules in the gray zone for months at a time (for example, by using their Totally Radz posting styles to pretend that they're just "joking" whenever you call them out for flaming, even though when you talk to them on skype or read their posts on facebook or whatever it's clear that they really think poorly of those people and are maliciously insulting them in front of their faces while ensuring that you can't "prove" it)

This isn't something that's happened once or twice, I'm talking about something that's happened MULTIPLE times over the course of actual YEARS

Your idea's already been tried. IT DOES NOT WORK with people who make it clear that they have no intention of playing fair (such as by, I don't know, breaking the rules by making several alts? Then whining that the bans on the alts weren't fair because they "weren't making bad posts," EVEN THOUGH IT'S EXPRESSLY AGAINST THE RULES TO MAKE ALTS. Then making the staff team out to be the bad guys because they didn't get their free handout. Then continuously trying to get a free handout by breaking the rules instead of asking for it through the proper channels. Yes. Great intentions.)

Honestly, the staff should probably just be more decisive about banning these people who keep skirting that gray line when they know that they're full of crap. But I feel for them a bit, you know, because every time they try to ban them...

you have the idiot defense brigade filled with people --very similar to you-- who think every problem can be solved by just being nice to people, because nobody would EVER take advantage of that, and this defense brigade will complain every single time these rule-breakers get banned, because they haven't paid enough attention to notice that they ARE breaking rules, because it is not obvious at a glance, and the defense makes no attempts to try to understand the situation first.

So yeah, no, your idea causes a lot of undue stress on staff members who don't deserve it, just to pander to people who don't deserve a second chance, in part because the staff will have to answer to people like you

[~Axis~]

Yes i am pretty simple, but when you think about it, its simplicity thats incredibly complex. That however, is a seperate discussion.


See the thing is the decision has already been made. Why not just accept the mod/admin judgement? Petie already explained that there was more than meets the eye in general. I'm pretty sure that mods would also talk to petie about it if they see that his decision was incorrect as well. If the decision still remains the same, then hey, not much one can do is there? The second point of my post was how you were bringing your point across, but its pretty obvious you dont care about that part.

Btw me accepting the idea of chances /=/ admins needing to pander/answer to me... or anyone. Their decision is their decision. Period. I dont have a say in it. Boy you're really trying to drive the point home huh? Pretty hell bent on getting it to the staff that they really gone and done it this time. Wouldnt PMs be more effective instead of wasting your time insulting a simpleton like me, or just being a dick to the people around you? I mean you want to see a change in how the staff handle things around here so it makes more sense to PM them directly about it.

Inb4 "i dont care stfu u don know shet"

[Petie]

So, for the record and in an attempt to end this particular line of questioning, StarSock did PM me and we did come to an understanding so there is really no need to continue down the "you should just accept the staff decision" path. There were assumptions made on both sides that have since been cleared up.

The rest of the discussion regarding the merits or pitfalls of said decision are fine, if not slightly unnecessary given that it's all taking place after the fact.

[puggsoy]

if things have calmed down then i just wanna say hi sengir i missed you (being here) please be a good person!!!



Seriously though welcome back

[StarSock64]

Yes i am pretty simple, but when you think about it, its simplicity thats incredibly complex. That however, is a seperate discussion.

Wow your edgy 6th grade-level philosophy sure showed me

See the thing is the decision has already been made. Why not just accept the mod/admin judgement? Petie already explained that there was more than meets the eye in general. 

Sometimes bad decisions deserve criticism. Particularly when those bad decisions are made countless times over a course of years.

Do you think it's "nice" to notice that someone is making decisions that are against their own best interests without realizing it, and then do nothing to point it out to them? Ohh but your brand of complacency is taking the high road because at least you didn't say mean things :]

The second point of my post was how you were bringing your point across, but its pretty obvious you dont care about that part.

When I first posted, I believed that it was the staff as a group that came to this decision.

And in that case, it was so much of a joke that I really didn't owe it to anyone to be polite, because it would just be way too pathetic if they repeated the cycle when they know exactly what would most likely happen. I mean come on dude, if you stress yourself out by making a bad call then that's an understandable mistake, but if you refuse to learn your lesson and make the same call every single time, even years later, then someone ought to just smack you.

What I found out instead was that it was Petie who made the decision, and he wasn't as involved/didn't remember a lot of the stuff that happened in this cycle in the past, and I feel kind of bad for being so harsh because in that case his decision is at least somewhat understandable.

But if the staff had made that decision as a group then I'd have no remorse for my tone at all lol

I'm pretty sure that mods would also talk to petie about it if they see that his decision was incorrect as well.

A mod did actually pop in here and say he disapproved, for what it's worth

I consulted nobody else in making it as I wanted to try to address a recurring problem in a new way.

Also the mods literally didn't have a say in it.

Btw me accepting the idea of chances /=/ admins needing to pander/answer to me... or anyone. Their decision is their decision. Period. I dont have a say in it.

Yeah I don't think so either, but in my experience they usually want to be fair to everyone and take other peoples' input seriously, and it hinders their ability to make decisions when they have to take into consideration the opinions of people who only have a shallow understanding of what it means to be kind and others who will demonize the staff for banning their precious troll friend

plus sometimes the staff team themselves don't even seem to pay attention to what's happening, and then they disagree among themselves because half of the team thinks the ultra defense squad is being reasonable or wants to avoid disappointing them, and the other half of the team was actually paying attention to the covert flaming missions going on.

Y'know I mean I hope that doesn't happen this time, but it sure doesn't hurt to point out this history to everyone on the board in preparation for the inevitable "but they're not doing anything wrong" hot topics

Boy you're really trying to drive the point home huh? Pretty hell bent on getting it to the staff that they really gone and done it this time.

Yeah

Wouldnt PMs be more effective instead of wasting your time insulting a simpleton like me, or just being a dick to the people around you? I mean you want to see a change in how the staff handle things around here so it makes more sense to PM them directly about it.

I think a years-long problem is worthy of a massive wake-up call, and honestly if the defense squad forms again then I hope people can just quote these posts and shortcut the process of having to explain everything to the people who don't pay attention lol

Calling attention to this crap was LONG overdue

[Maxpphire]

Ok so guys stop arguing

It's been in our rules for a while that us Staff members are human, you know what that means? It means we're prone to making mistakes. We obviously want our members to point out when they feel as if we made a mistake, that doesn't mean that you shouldn't be respectful about the situation regardless or whether or not you agree with one side over the other.

Do I agree with Sengir's unbanning? Not really. I've already discussed with Petie as to why and whats going on with that as it has less to do with my personal misgivings with her and more to do with several other not staff member's concerns about her coming back.

This is her last "Public" change that we're giving her, as we gave her several chances to be ok when she would just so show up then eventually poop on the floor and blame our grandmas. Provided she doesn't do that, I can tolerate her. I'm a firm believer of actions speaking louder then words, and if she can prove that she isn't going to harass people or break the rules, then sure. I personally don't see her lasting very long on here while being an active poster, but only time can really tell that for sure now.

[Rhyme]

congrats on your fourth last chance